Forums - MvsC2 ranking by Japanese Forums (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/index.php) - Gaming Discussion (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=8) -- MvsC2 ranking by Japanese (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=37545) Posted by white on August 27th, 2001 11:57 AM: MvsC2 ranking by Japanese Hello. First, I would like to say thanks for everything in B5. That was very good experiment for all of Japanese members. Now CVS2 is the most popular in Japan, every one uses Sagat In MVC2, Magneto revived and many people use him. We will experiences MVC2 competiton more and prepare for the next battle. The last time, Most of Japanese top player MVC2 couldn't go B5. I hope USA vs JAPAN will be held in Japan. BTW, I made MVC2 ranking. I would like to show you guys. It is not just in my opinion, judged from latest tournament result in JAPAN and other player's opinion. 1-5 Sakura, Cable, Sentinel, Storm, Blackheart 6-15 Spiral, Strider, Magneto, Dhalsim, Ironman, Cammy, Cyc, Doom, CapCom, Iceman 16-30 Ruby, Ken, Colossus, Psylocke, M.Bison, Sonson, Omegared, T.Bonne, Hulk, Venom, Megaman, Warmachine, Silversamurai, Marrow, Rogue #(IMO 1-5) Sakura, Strider, Dhalsim, Spiral, Blackheart It is impossible to make accurate ranking, but I think this ranking reflects most Japanese player's opinion. I will not comment with each character because whether one can win or not is depend on player's skill. But I just want to say Sakura in MVC2 is better than her in A3. Sorry I am quite busy now. I would like to post more later. -white Posted by Shuzer on August 27th, 2001 01:18 PM: Looks like I'll be the first to say this. Sakura in top 5 o.O The other 4 I understand(though I would switch Cable for Spiral or Magneto). I'm very curious about Sakura now... Posted by Grimloc on August 27th, 2001 01:27 PM: Yes, I am curious of Sakura as well. Damn Japanese, always hiding the good shit... __________________ Public Relations|www.psx2unicom.com Posted by Taramoor on August 27th, 2001 02:02 PM: YES! MwA-HA-HA-Ha-HA-hA! Sakura's on top, I Knew IT! Excellent ranking white, very well done. I notice the similarity between this and Viscant's recent posting (Except for Sakura... I repeat, Mwa-HA-HA-Ha-HA-hA!). So, some semi-agreed upon top tiers are beginning to appear. *does a little dance* *Chuckle* Anyway, I sincerely hope we'll get a little something regarding why later. Despite my fondness for Sakura, her lack of long range ground control prevents me from thinking she's at the top. High Second? Yes. But I don't think at the top. I still hate that G*ddamn Sentinel, but hey, whatcha gonna do? I wish I coulda gone to B5, I woulda busted out my Sakura, sho'okened like a madman, and lost in the drawing pool. Oh well. Peace. __________________ "Explorers are we, intrepid and bold, Out in the wild, amongst wonders untold. Equipped with our wits, a map, and a snack, We're searching for fun and we're on the right track!" -Calvin and Hobbes Read my Fanfic "Ultimate Gaming Megamix" (Yes, I know the title sucks) Yay! Avatar 1.0 by me... Then 2.0 by Rune... New 3.0 by SpiderOptix... Don't change your av. Upgrade! Posted by arcticninja on August 27th, 2001 02:06 PM: Sakura??? What the hell? Please explain. __________________ As a story is told and retold over the course of generations, no matter the attention paid to detail and no matter the importance of the tale, the truth is gradually nibbled away by little mistakes and innocent exaggerations. Carried off on these well-intentioned, tiny feet, the facts deteriorate softly and painlessly into a condition generally referred as "shrouded by time." The legends concerning the Arctic Ninja are shrouded by time. Posted by Team Strider on August 27th, 2001 02:45 PM: You should not switch Cable for Magneto. I actally happen to like their top 5. Sakura can be really nasty if used properly. It is like White said. Any character can win it is all dependent on the players skill. __________________ It is all about Team Strider! Posted by Perfecto on August 27th, 2001 02:55 PM: whats more shocking to me is that they left mag out of the top 5. sakura was the first bitch i used in mvc2. i thought she was awesome along with morrigan and wolvie... then i learned the hard way how not awesome that team was... i'd like to know just like everyone else in here how sakura is a top tier. Posted by LynX on August 27th, 2001 02:59 PM: 1 thing One thought strikes through my mind: Where's Storm ? __________________ Weakness is a disease ... I'm the cure ! Posted by ShadyK on August 27th, 2001 03:03 PM: All I have to say is that E. Sakura is theoretically INVINCIBLE. Her teleport has 0 frame vulnerabilitiy on startup AND on recovery meaning she can teleport into an existing AHVB or HVB and right as she recovers inside the HVB, she can teleport again without being touched. __________________ shadyk http://www.clockw0rk.com/shadyk Posted by Blackheart2097 on August 27th, 2001 03:07 PM: it's about time evil sakura got some credit!!!! i always new she was nice. it's just that to many people wanna stick to the so called top tiers that they don't give anyone else a try.i new she was nice __________________ Blackheart is the only god! We all must bow down to him or welcome death. He is the ultimate being. Posted by Aeriousan on August 27th, 2001 03:10 PM: Re: 1 thing quote: Originally posted by LynX One thought strikes through my mind: Where's Storm ? in the top 5 in JAPAN. u people are forgettin that these rankings are considered ONLY IN JAPAN!!! and sakura is devastatin on good hands. u people just refused to use her cus of her weaknesses and most of u, are scared of the almighty AHVB...silly. __________________ I am the Freezing Iron MegaMAN. but "THE MAN OF MEN" is more common Cool! I WIN! can I take your power now? --M E G A M A N Posted by LynX on August 27th, 2001 03:21 PM: Re: Re: 1 thing quote: Originally posted by Aeriousan in the top 5 in JAPAN. u people are forgettin that these rankings are considered ONLY IN JAPAN!!! No offense at ALL, but so ? Storm should anyways be top tier, even if we are talking Japan .... __________________ Weakness is a disease ... I'm the cure ! Posted by Grimloc on August 27th, 2001 03:38 PM: quote: Originally posted by ShadyK All I have to say is that E. Sakura is theoretically INVINCIBLE. Her teleport has 0 frame vulnerabilitiy on startup AND on recovery meaning she can teleport into an existing AHVB or HVB and right as she recovers inside the HVB, she can teleport again without being touched. Ya know, I completely forgot about that, lol. I remember watching BAS I believe it was using E. Sakura teleporting past Sentinel's assists and Cable's HVB and AHVB. Have we truely found the bane of Cable?? B6=Buttloads of E.Sakura players. __________________ Public Relations|www.psx2unicom.com Posted by Million on August 27th, 2001 03:49 PM: and to think....the only time I've ever put Sakura on my team was when I wasn't even taking the match seriously bah, none of these tiers really matter to me anyway....it's not like I'll have the time/money to show up at a tournament anytime soon. __________________ "the moment you become predictable...you've already lost. Be like water." Posted by Monkey on August 27th, 2001 04:03 PM: quote: Originally posted by ShadyK All I have to say is that E. Sakura is theoretically INVINCIBLE. Her teleport has 0 frame vulnerabilitiy on startup AND on recovery meaning she can teleport into an existing AHVB or HVB and right as she recovers inside the HVB, she can teleport again without being touched. Ya, I noticed this when I played some guy using her. She is with out a doubt top 5. -m0nkey __________________ Infinites R Us.. Magneto, Psylocke, Storm, Cyclops, Dr. Doom, Chun Li, Cammy, Silver Samurai Posted by Aeriousan on August 27th, 2001 04:17 PM: Re: Re: Re: 1 thing quote: Originally posted by LynX No offense at ALL, but so ? Storm should anyways be top tier, even if we are talking Japan .... in Japan, she's on the TOP FIVE...ain't that considered to be top tier? anyways i'm really that i didn't see JIN ANYWHERE!! __________________ I am the Freezing Iron MegaMAN. but "THE MAN OF MEN" is more common Cool! I WIN! can I take your power now? --M E G A M A N Posted by master ken on August 27th, 2001 04:32 PM: Sakura is top 5 !! I thought she was a low tier like all the shotos, Interesting __________________ Ken expert. Posted by LynX on August 27th, 2001 04:38 PM: Re: Re: Re: Re: 1 thing quote: Originally posted by Aeriousan in Japan, she's on the TOP FIVE...ain't that considered to be top tier? Sorry man ... I must be blind today ... I dunno how I could miss her but in some way I did ... sorry __________________ Weakness is a disease ... I'm the cure ! Posted by Aeriousan on August 27th, 2001 05:11 PM: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 1 thing quote: Originally posted by LynX Sorry man ... I must be blind today ... I dunno how I could miss her but in some way I did ... sorry no need to apologize man...it's all good!! ...but i still don't see JIN anywhere... __________________ I am the Freezing Iron MegaMAN. but "THE MAN OF MEN" is more common Cool! I WIN! can I take your power now? --M E G A M A N Posted by Psycho Soldier on August 27th, 2001 06:32 PM: I've seen Sakura go from a laughable character, now reaching the upper tiers in MvC2. I always knew she had potential... maybe not top five, but then again I haven't been playing MvC2 for the last 6-7 months or so. Excuse me while I shed a tear of joy... long live Sakura! hee hee hee... __________________ "I don't think... therefore I ain't" - Green Velvet "What strength! But don't forget there are many other Street Fighters like you all over the world!" Posted by Ultima on August 27th, 2001 07:18 PM: Re: 1 thing quote: Originally posted by LynX One thought strikes through my mind: Where's Storm ? Since no one else seems to have noticed this, I put forth the following from white's original post: quote: 1-5 Sakura, Cable, Sentinel, Storm, Blackheart I'm wondering if you people can actually read... Also, until someone breaks down exactly what Sakura does to compete the Usual Suspects (teleporting around gives her an escape, but doesn't translate into much damage, and most of the top characters can kill/severely damage her before she can gain the levels necessary to turn into E.Sakura and build up meter again to do damage), I still think she's stuck in lower tier. __________________ Ultima - The Right Arm of Scrub Voltron http://uramble.com/ Posted by Wil Power on August 27th, 2001 07:37 PM: Most definitely agree on these rankings! Won't say how or why...but I just like the characters that are ranked at the top. Evil Sakura is just too "cool" to play. Talk about total invincibility when teleporting...no traps! Down here in Hawaii, we do have some Sakura players that use Sakura like how it is described here on this thread. Some are even more advanced. I won't elaborate on it...but all I can say is that some characters that are classified in the lower tiers are now stepping up. Now...we all must ask this question..."Why now?" __________________ Hiten Mitsurugi Ryu...Kuzu...Ryu...Sen!!! Posted by LynX on August 27th, 2001 07:40 PM: Re: Re: 1 thing quote: Originally posted by Ultima I'm wondering if you people can actually read... Hey, I said I was sorry, and that I nowmore are able to read .. (I got a quick course from my mom ;P) __________________ Weakness is a disease ... I'm the cure ! Posted by Xecutioner on August 27th, 2001 08:02 PM: well white has proven that sakura was top tier on friday before b5.his team was spiral/sakura/capcom.once he got 5 levels he switch into e.sakura and clean house with her powerful combos.plus her teleporting is xcellent __________________ You are free to make choices......But you are not free to choose the consequences of your choices. -Xecutioner- Posted by ID II on August 27th, 2001 08:40 PM: Sakura has powerful combos? tell me a couple, i'm intrigued. And again..If sakura was so good..why didnt we see her in tourney play? Everyone uses joke around teams pre- tourney..and if he got wins with her, doesent make her top tier. __________________ http://www.diskreet.com "Now THAT's a woman. And thats a car Thats a house thats a fish thats a bee!" Posted by The Green Lantern on August 27th, 2001 08:45 PM: all i have to say about Sakura is that her combo damage and ability of combos is very much related with the word HIGH. not only does she have high potential, but given the right assist, she can combo herself pretty well. in the early days, i've even seen Justin Wong pickin on Sakura and make a good performance for the people around to enjoy the game. that was quite a sight. it's no wonder Japan took notice to her. __________________ "In Brightest Day, In Blackest Night, No Evil Shall Escape My Sight! Let Those Who Worship Evil's Might, Beware My Power--GREEN LANTERN'S LIGHT!" Posted by n817azn on August 27th, 2001 09:03 PM: WHOA!!!!!!!!!!!!Sakura????? How very interesting indeed. I'm very curious of why this is. So, White could you please explain why she is so great, and what kind of strats etc. make her this way. Thanks. n8 __________________ " 3rd coast born, that means i'm Texas raised, livin lavish is a habit so i gotta stay paid.........." The late and great Fat Pat. ironman inf. from assists guide inf. to pc Posted by BarrelO on August 27th, 2001 09:12 PM: Once you turn her dark, Sakura is definitely a force to be reckoned with. You can't overlook an instant teleport and an instant beam super. Her main problem is that she's a black hole for super meter, even more so than Cable. It takes three meters to turn her dark, and her most damaging combos involve supers. I think she could be top tier if her transformation only took one level, but as it is, I don't know. __________________ Where there's smoke, there's fun! Posted by Jin Rules! on August 27th, 2001 10:07 PM: I just played around with her and she IS actually pretty damn good. I double teleported through a Proton Cannon for chrissake! She plays differently then the other top tiers, but I can see her being up there. Not high, but at least top second. You would need a good battery before bringing in Sak, but then again you need a good battery before bringing in cable as well. I can see a few decent teams with her being like Spiral/Sakura/Sentinal Storm/Sakura/AAA Mags/Sakura/AAA Ironman/Sakura/Psy Anyway, I'm gonna start learning her! (nothing else to do) __________________ Sold out to Magneto after my Spiral/Cable/Sent team got dominated by rushdown. That's right, "where'd my soul go?" Posted by Taramoor on August 27th, 2001 10:26 PM: Oh no! Now that white acknowledged she's really good EVERYBODY is gonna start playing Sakura. My originality and element of surprise just went out the window. Anyway, everybody seems to be screaming that Sakura's best combos involve meter. That is NOT true. Her Air Hurricane is just as whacked out as Ken and Akuma's, try it sometime. It's just a little bit harder to land multiple hits, it isn't a downender like Ryu's and it doesn't element-stun like Ken and Akuma. Try this combo: j.hp, land, c.hp (launch), sj.lk, sj.mp, AHK, airthrow. The damage is absolutely unreal. Also, her Sentinel-only infinite is easy and truly badass. (In corner) j.lp, j.mp, j.hp, lk.AHK, land, repeat. Mwa-ha-ha. Best Sakura Memory: Magneto tries to rush that sh*t down, I hit the start button, and he flies to the other side of the screen. Sakura rules. Live with it. __________________ "Explorers are we, intrepid and bold, Out in the wild, amongst wonders untold. Equipped with our wits, a map, and a snack, We're searching for fun and we're on the right track!" -Calvin and Hobbes Read my Fanfic "Ultimate Gaming Megamix" (Yes, I know the title sucks) Yay! Avatar 1.0 by me... Then 2.0 by Rune... New 3.0 by SpiderOptix... Don't change your av. Upgrade! Posted by Banshee on August 27th, 2001 10:43 PM: quote: Originally posted by Jin Rules! I double teleported through a Proton Cannon for chrissake! Do you mean your second teleport was in front of IM _during_ his Proton cannon?? __________________ Poutine yo! Posted by Grimloc on August 28th, 2001 12:08 AM: Yes, that's the thing about E. Sakura. You can double teleport through anything b/c of its 0 startup time. I watched White do it at B5 through a sentinel assist, then again through the accompaning HVB. Sakura appeared behind them and raped them with a 5 hit ground chain into beam super. Its so damn ugly and it hurts. >_< __________________ Public Relations|www.psx2unicom.com Posted by Crimson_Samurai on August 28th, 2001 12:25 AM: If you guys had the slightest understanding of Japanese culture then you would realize why all the guys over there pick her. Posted by tragic on August 28th, 2001 12:34 AM: I wonder if white came on and said Sabretooth was #1, how many bandwagoneers would come out of the woodwork and say "yeah, I've been playing him this whole time... I can see why he's #1..." LOL! tragic - MVC2 Master, Tied with ShadyK and Clockw0rk @ B5 __________________ http://www.shoryuken.com/~tragic/trag02.gif Posted by Mouko on August 28th, 2001 12:41 AM: I agree with tragic. What the hell is up with all these "I told you so" people? like that hawaii guy who says "I agree although I don't know why" It's stupid. You see Japan and automatically think it's right. I hate mvc2, which is why I been using Morrigan/Sakura/Tron (which has been named Team Union City), I've used this team at the last SVGL tournies and beat a few people with it. I do retarded 50% throws with Sakura and Tron, 100% combo with Morrigan/Tron. "infinte" teleport with Evil sak. I don't expect to win. I'm not posting here to say "i've been using sakura before white posted!" Why? Cause even though I've been playing her for a long time, I know she still sucks. People need to stop kissing ass. None of you "knew" sakura was top or "proved it" you see Japan and jump on the bandwagon. Shush kiddies. __________________ Peter "Mouko" Nguyen IRC: Mouko AIM: I will XCOPY Must...find..Beanie Girl Posted by Lar-ry$ on August 28th, 2001 12:47 AM: quote: Originally posted by Mouko I agree with tragic. What the hell is up with all these "I told you so" people? like that hawaii guy who says "I agree although I don't know why" It's stupid. You see Japan and automatically think it's right. I hate mvc2, which is why I been using Morrigan/Sakura/Tron (which has been named Team Union City), I've used this team at the last SVGL tournies and beat a few people with it. I do retarded 50% throws with Sakura and Tron, 100% combo with Morrigan/Tron. "infinte" teleport with Evil sak. I don't expect to win. I'm not posting here to say "i've been using sakura before white posted!" Why? Cause even though I've been playing her for a long time, I know she still sucks. People need to stop kissing ass. None of you "knew" sakura was top or "proved it" you see Japan and jump on the bandwagon. Shush kiddies. leave em' alone mouko! leave em' alone! Posted by BlackShinobi on August 28th, 2001 12:50 AM: damn ShadyK beat me to it Evil Sakura beat Cable and a grounded Sentinel easily. I've been seeing it for 8-10 months now. But the last time I mentioned it (about 5 months ago) everyone thought I was crazy. VBs, AHVBs, Sentinel's s.hp, drones, HSF, hail storms and most traps all lose to evil sakura's teleport because it starts up instantly, and you can block IMMEDIATELY after it finishes. The tranformation also has almost no lag. Her shinkuu hadouken takes about the same block and regular damage as a proton cannon and may not be AHVBable (not sure). and if you don't believe me PM anyone from Philly and ask them there is a guy who has beenn using battery/Assist/Sakura as his Main team since MVC2 came out. Its still the only type of team he plays. __________________ I get to call Juggernaut a fat piece of shit because I use him. That's the rule. R.I.P Baby Girl Posted by Ouroborus on August 28th, 2001 01:00 AM: evil sakura is old news http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/sho...&threadid=17362 __________________ You must defeat Doom to stand a chance - Strider Hiryu Posted by Psycho Soldier on August 28th, 2001 01:18 AM: quote: Originally posted by Mouko I agree with tragic. What the hell is up with all these "I told you so" people? like that hawaii guy who says "I agree although I don't know why" It's stupid. You see Japan and automatically think it's right. I hate mvc2, which is why I been using Morrigan/Sakura/Tron (which has been named Team Union City), I've used this team at the last SVGL tournies and beat a few people with it. I do retarded 50% throws with Sakura and Tron, 100% combo with Morrigan/Tron. "infinte" teleport with Evil sak. I don't expect to win. I'm not posting here to say "i've been using sakura before white posted!" Why? Cause even though I've been playing her for a long time, I know she still sucks. People need to stop kissing ass. None of you "knew" sakura was top or "proved it" you see Japan and jump on the bandwagon. Shush kiddies. However, there were many people who did voice a few other options that could have made people's eyes open. Many people when this game first came out started to talk about Sakura's potential, and 95% of the gaming community here laughed at it. I even remembered speaking about her infinite, how her aerial hurricane kick does the same type of damage as Ken's aerial hurricane, and her dash assist before others... again laughed at before someone did it in a tournament. I'm not saying that I'm the best or an expert, however, if people would have listened to some of the ideas floating around by some of the non-tourney players you may have been able to figure out some of this. Sakura is a character I have always used in this game alongside others like Morrigan, Felicia, BB Hood and Ken. I never played the game to get extremely good at it, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that some characters do have some sort of potential. I think this proves that every opinion, regardless if it's from an expert or not, could hold some sort of truth if you're willing to listen to everything with an open mind and experiment yourself. More innovators, people... not imitators. __________________ "I don't think... therefore I ain't" - Green Velvet "What strength! But don't forget there are many other Street Fighters like you all over the world!" Posted by ShadyK on August 28th, 2001 02:36 AM: quote: Originally posted by tragic tragic - MVC2 Master, Tied with ShadyK and Clockw0rk @ B5 MrWizard tied with us too! *Pinches tragic's nipple __________________ shadyk http://www.clockw0rk.com/shadyk Posted by Red Spiral on August 28th, 2001 04:19 AM: I'm not surprised Sakura is top-tier in Japan. There is still so much that isn't discovered in this game other than the top-tiers right now. We only know about 60% of this game so far, but we are still far from mastering it. __________________ Once the Cable's Disconnected, the Party's Over! To Be Victorious, Your Hands Must Be Faster Than Your Mind. Tagmonkey! - The Best Avatar Makers on the Web. Posted by Rollchan on August 28th, 2001 04:21 AM: Sakura isn't new. I've seen someone using her in a Berekly tournement a while back. She raped a couple of teams. __________________ Konaide! Posted by ID on August 28th, 2001 05:05 AM: quote: Originally posted by Red Spiral I'm not surprised Sakura is top-tier in Japan. There is still so much that isn't discovered in this game other than the top-tiers right now. We only know about 60% of this game so far, but we are still far from mastering it. The game is dead, fool. __________________ http://www.diskreet.com "HELP ME CUZ HELP ME PLEASE" Posted by Kenny on August 28th, 2001 05:07 AM: I use a little bit of Sakura.......although i never turn her Evil before.....i'll do that next time and try out her "Evil" form....... As for Combo's......ya she got HIGH damaging combo's without Supers.....but it's hard because it is hard to launch with her. Her's the combo i use for her..... Launch, Jab, short, jab,.....short hurricane kick.....jab, air rushing dragon punch. Anyways,......someone posted that she can teleport multiple times thru beams.......even if the teleport ended and started again inside the beam (Something about no startup time in the beginning and end of the teleport)............ If that's true.......wouldn't that mean i can CONSTANTLY teleport like mad thru EVERYTHING???.........even inside beams and ALL other attacks??? if that's true...................then all anyone need to do is is use the spiral trap........DHC into Evil Sakura (yes u can use the transformation to DHC, i've seen it done before)......then just keep teleporting BACK over and over again.....and my opponent can never touch me......... Posted by master ken on August 28th, 2001 05:08 AM: Taka Michinoku : Sakura is EEEEEEEEEEEEVIL!!! Taka's teamate : INDEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED!!!! __________________ Ken expert. Posted by Red Spiral on August 28th, 2001 05:45 AM: quote: Originally posted by ID The game is dead, fool. You live in Westwood. MvC2 is really popular there, I don't see anyone not playing either at X-cape in UCLA or that arcade by the theatre. BTW, is there a place in Westwood that has Garou? I am gonna go there soon and want to actually play it for once, that game is only in SHGL and hidden throughout the rest of the world! __________________ Once the Cable's Disconnected, the Party's Over! To Be Victorious, Your Hands Must Be Faster Than Your Mind. Tagmonkey! - The Best Avatar Makers on the Web. Posted by THE_LAW on August 28th, 2001 06:26 AM: well nobody in NY plays that corny bitch....evil or not she sucks she doesn't have anything over powering i.e. an instant super(AHVB) that can kill both u and your helper or a domonating trap like spirals wall of swords! plus shes just beging to be rushd the fuck down! it takes too much time and energy to make he "evil" and once u do there is no garantee that she will just domonate! hell what if i land a combo early and just snap the bitch in, then what! with about one and a half levels she has a long way to go to reach her goal of 3(if she is not dead before then). all of a sudden everybodys a sakura master, yet i can't for the life of me ever remember ever seeing any one placing top 50 with that bitch wtf. now i'm not saying she couldn't win some random matches but as far as her being top tier you gotta be kidding me!!! that bitch is.... Posted by Defective on August 28th, 2001 06:53 AM: MvsC2 ranking by Japanese After reading what White had to say I was intrigued and gave E.Sakura a shot but I'm not really feeling it. Yeah, the teleport is nice and the Shinku Hadoken is good but is that really enough? Here's what I don't get: 1.Meter-I don't remember if White mentioned that E.Sakura was the only way to play but getting all that meter can be a bitch. It takes at least 3 to change and that not even counting the fact of trying to bring her in safely. That's alot a meter to build up and that can easily not happen with a few mistakes. What if a smart player snaps her in early, can she build her own meter? 2.Teleport-Yeah it allows her to move anywhere for free but look how slow it is. How many mistakes can you punish that aren't Proton Cannon long? Whose to say when you get there the enemy won't already be gone? Unlike any other teleport in the game, her's is slow as molasses (at least Bison's or Psylocke's can be confusing). 3.Strategy-What does she do when she gets inside? Punch throw into cross-up? Drop Doom AAA and teleport again? To me she lacks what the MvC2 Gods have and that is the speed. The better characters in the game are the ones that get to places in a hurry or have options that quickly have the enemy blocking stuff. If the top MvC2 characters have anything in common it's that there extremely hard to get away from their pressure tactics. This ranges from getting out knife traps to trying to get Magneto off your ass. I see some 2nd tier potential maybe but I can't begin to imagine what she can do to put her up there with MvC2 royalty. Posted by Kenny on August 28th, 2001 07:16 AM: Hey can someone answer this for me...... It was posted earlier that E.Sakura's Teleport has no startup in the beginning and no lag at the end......and that she can telport within a Beam......is this true?? Can someone explain to the properties of her teleport to me a little better??? I know people posted that she can teleport away from supers....even instant one's...... Say i teleport away from Iron Man's Proton Cannon........does it mean i can teleport half-way into the beam of the proton cannon and still be able to teleport out of it?? I'm just a little confused on the properties of her teleport........ If this is true...........then wouldn't it mean i can constantly teleport over and over again........and NOTHING will ever touch Sakura??? Posted by Bruton on August 28th, 2001 07:26 AM: I always saw Sakura's true power in that dashing attack of hers. That thing is invincible to everything except low attacks like sweeps or zombies I think... including AHVB. The instant teleport on the other hand sounds nice... if you dropped a combination of Doom or Ken while teleporting perfectly or something. I'm thinking she'd be used as a counter perhaps... against Spiral for instance? __________________ -Bruton Why do all of my opponents seem to be set to one star? Posted by BroodKill on August 28th, 2001 08:03 AM: Her teleport gets hit out of by low attacks? Then I guess Run-away E.Sakura wouldn't exactly work. Posted by BlackShinobi on August 28th, 2001 09:34 AM: quote: Originally posted by THE_LAW well nobody in NY plays that corny bitch....evil or not she sucks she doesn't have anything over powering i.e. an instant super(AHVB) that can kill both u and your helper or a domonating trap like spirals wall of swords! plus shes just beging to be rushd the fuck down! it takes too much time and energy to make he "evil" and once u do there is no garantee that she will just domonate! hell what if i land a combo early and just snap the bitch in, then what! with about one and a half levels she has a long way to go to reach her goal of 3(if she is not dead before then). all of a sudden everybodys a sakura master, yet i can't for the life of me ever remember ever seeing any one placing top 50 with that bitch wtf. now i'm not saying she couldn't win some random matches but as far as her being top tier you gotta be kidding me!!! that bitch is.... Evil Sakura/AAA is seriously hard to rush down Plus her assist characters are alomst unAHVBable because she can teleport behind cable after he starts the AHVB __________________ I get to call Juggernaut a fat piece of shit because I use him. That's the rule. R.I.P Baby Girl Posted by Bruton on August 28th, 2001 10:35 AM: No, her teleport is invincible. Normal Sakura's dash attack however is almost invincible- it can be hit by low attacks. I believe that Normal Sakura's dash attack will go through AHVB and Storm's Alpha assist, but of course it doesn't last forever. __________________ -Bruton Why do all of my opponents seem to be set to one star? Posted by Psycho Soldier on August 28th, 2001 12:35 PM: quote: Originally posted by THE_LAW well nobody in NY plays that corny bitch....evil or not she sucks she doesn't have anything over powering i.e. an instant super(AHVB) that can kill both u and your helper or a domonating trap like spirals wall of swords! plus shes just beging to be rushd the fuck down! it takes too much time and energy to make he "evil" and once u do there is no garantee that she will just domonate! You've just exposed why you personally don't like Sakura... She takes too much work (for you) to be successful with. You look for characters that have obvious advantages, and don't like using characters that take a little more work in order to be successful with. You're content to stick with your reliable team of supposed top tier characters for you know that it works, despit how boring it must be seeing yet another top tier team in the game. And you wonder why people don't like MvC2 as much as other games... here is something that people actually may try to use, and the supposed voices from the un-experimental types (such as yourself) start to ring out in protest. These tricks are obviously working for some people out there... why don't you actually try to do something different for once? Or are you just that afraid you'll lose? The fear of going against the norm is pretty to me, not the idea of some new techniques that coukd actually breath some extra life in an dying game. __________________ "I don't think... therefore I ain't" - Green Velvet "What strength! But don't forget there are many other Street Fighters like you all over the world!" Posted by Galactic on August 28th, 2001 01:44 PM: What the hell so are u people saying that Sakura could have an invincible/unstoppable runaway?! That's crazy, and sure to be banned from tourneys, no? Like the Gambit glitch... Yet it's not a glitch... Odd. __________________ ^_-; Posted by Eric Magnus on August 28th, 2001 03:31 PM: ROFL I've seen more interesting MvC2 posts lately than I have in months. New strats, new chars, new tiers... Don't mind ID. Every board he goes to, he goes around trumpeting the death of MvC2 at the hands of CvS2. Maybe he thinks if he says it enough, it'll become true lol __________________ Team Sandusky: As soon as we get in a tourney we'll pipe down. Brian Holdren - Storm/Cammy/Doom Roger Hartzell - Magneto/Cable/Ken Joe Gill - Sent/Cable/Cyke Posted by Gilliam on August 28th, 2001 03:36 PM: quote: Originally posted by Eric Magnus ROFL I've seen more interesting MvC2 posts lately than I have in months. New strats, new chars, new tiers... Don't mind ID. Every board he goes to, he goes around trumpeting the death of MvC2 at the hands of CvS2. Maybe he thinks if he says it enough, it'll become true lol oh i see, well the only game that CvS2 is gonna kill is CvS. __________________ Bonerine owns u all!!!! teams that i'm fucking around with morrigan/sent storm/tron bonerine/sent/blackheart R.I.P Aaliyah your music was the shit and you were and still are my fav female artist Posted by Cornelius on August 28th, 2001 07:55 PM: Runaway Sakura = too hard. 1: Get her in Evil mode (3 meters) safely 2: Have her winning when she does 3: Do repeated DP motions timed between her 0 frame recovery and whenever her opponent attacks her next. I.e. If she doesn't time her 0 frame recovery perfectly with a DP motion, she will get trapped. Unless you have very friendly sticks and ungodly timing, I think it's impossible to do more than 2-3 reps. 4: And what's her teleport motion? DP, RDP? 2P, 2K? I don't play Sakura, but I bet she has a fuck up move like Ragnarok or Wall climb. Posted by Taramoor on August 28th, 2001 08:09 PM: quote: Originally posted by Cornelius Runaway Sakura = too hard. 1: Get her in Evil mode (3 meters) safely 2: Have her winning when she does 3: Do repeated DP motions timed between her 0 frame recovery and whenever her opponent attacks her next. I.e. If she doesn't time her 0 frame recovery perfectly with a DP motion, she will get trapped. Unless you have very friendly sticks and ungodly timing, I think it's impossible to do more than 2-3 reps. 4: And what's her teleport motion? DP, RDP? 2P, 2K? I don't play Sakura, but I bet she has a fuck up move like Ragnarok or Wall climb. 1) Any good battery character. If you want to be absolutely safe, you can DHC into the transformation. Stupid, but doable. She doesn't need meter once she's transformed unless you want to show off and Shun Goku Satsu somebody. 2) Most good batteries (Except the famed "Runaway 'Gief") play a good keepaway and/or combo game. If you're building meter properly, you will be either ahead, or close to it, when Sakura comes in. 3) You can do the DP motion while she's in blockstun, and you have more than one frame to do it a second time, once she's stopped moving either forward or backward you can do it again and she'll still be invincible while she starts up the next teleport. Whiffed Teleports: She has one 'I can live with it' f*ck up, one 'oh crap!' f*ck up, and one 'Holy God I just lost the match...' f*ck up. They are, respectively, accidentally doing her (qcf+PP) Shinkuu Hadoken... could be worse. Accidentally doing her (qcf+KK) Midare Zakura... not the worst mistake in the world. Accidentally reversing her transformation... if this ever happens to you, you have my pity. Sakura is good... but Sakura is better. __________________ "Explorers are we, intrepid and bold, Out in the wild, amongst wonders untold. Equipped with our wits, a map, and a snack, We're searching for fun and we're on the right track!" -Calvin and Hobbes Read my Fanfic "Ultimate Gaming Megamix" (Yes, I know the title sucks) Yay! Avatar 1.0 by me... Then 2.0 by Rune... New 3.0 by SpiderOptix... Don't change your av. Upgrade! Posted by cheese_master on August 28th, 2001 08:52 PM: quote: Originally posted by Cornelius Runaway Sakura = too hard. 1: Get her in Evil mode (3 meters) safely 2: Have her winning when she does 3: Do repeated DP motions timed between her 0 frame recovery and whenever her opponent attacks her next. I.e. If she doesn't time her 0 frame recovery perfectly with a DP motion, she will get trapped. Unless you have very friendly sticks and ungodly timing, I think it's impossible to do more than 2-3 reps. 4: And what's her teleport motion? DP, RDP? 2P, 2K? I don't play Sakura, but I bet she has a fuck up move like Ragnarok or Wall climb. I always knew Sak's teleport had no start up or recovery... but I didn't know it meant u can teleport in and out of shit... thats just the worst way rub it in on a Cable scrub. But runaway Sak ain't too hard once u are Evil. Yesterday like 7 matchs in a row I just constantly teleported for 40 secs. Once u get the rhythm and timing of the teleportation motion u like... it gets pretty easy. __________________ A bum asks a man for two dollars. The man says, "If I give you the money, will you just use it to buy booze?" The bum says no. The man asks, "Will you spend it off in the arcade?" The bum says no. Then the man asks, "Then will you come home with me so my wife can see what happens to a man who doesn’t drink or play videogames?" Posted by Red_Spiral on August 28th, 2001 09:36 PM: quote: Originally posted by Eric Magnus ROFL I've seen more interesting MvC2 posts lately than I have in months. New strats, new chars, new tiers... Don't mind ID. Every board he goes to, he goes around trumpeting the death of MvC2 at the hands of CvS2. Maybe he thinks if he says it enough, it'll become true lol ID lives in Westwood. When I go there, there are ALWAYS tons of people on MvC2 either in the X-Cape in UCLA or the arcade by the theatre. I guess he just doesn't do go the arcades, that's all. But I'm still awaiting my response to a place where I can find Garou in Westwood. __________________ Taking out idiots one by one, this young businessman making money on the side while armed with his wondrous knowledge of just about practically everything, he struggles to maintain a normal, stress-free life. Yet the only thing that truly can even come close to touching him is his ex-girlfriend?! Tagmonkey! - Don't you fucking DARE click on this link! Flamewar.com - Click here for senseless flames. Posted by Limp_Bizkit666 on August 29th, 2001 12:58 AM: quote: Originally posted by Red_Spiral ID lives in Westwood. When I go there, there are ALWAYS tons of people on MvC2 either in the X-Cape in UCLA or the arcade by the theatre. I guess he just doesn't do go the arcades, that's all. But I'm still awaiting my response to a place where I can find Garou in Westwood. too bad it's not true. =[ __________________ Rags Under Nads... that's what you'll smell like when you piss on your pants. ----- oh, and do you know cactus? cactus who? STFU! Posted by Btk_Matt on August 29th, 2001 03:11 AM: INDEED __________________ The Blood in me runnin my mental, the thug in me stuck in me keepin it simple, the bone in me runnin with thugs so, too the temple, buck when u duck too the thuggish ruggish G's St.Clair T's an appeal to the G's an a buck too all my enemies Posted by =Mr. Chibi= on August 29th, 2001 03:32 AM: Ah. Sakura, let me give you some information relatively critical to this subject: Sakura was very aggressive in A2, starting there she made he maximum debut. Playing in V-ism was a great deal because of her juggling capabilites from full screen. (mp shoryuken, b+hp, repeat until you hit the corner). From there, her strength was average. I don't think Sakura will dominate in MvC2 for a little reason. I just won't tell . Mostly because her capabilites of not having a good anti-air. But she has very good potential in some ways. I kow she does. I KNOW SHE DOES!!! __________________ =Mr. Chibi= chibi_chin@hotmail.com MvC2: Magneto, Cammy, Sentinel/Storm Project Justice: Powered Akira, Demon Hyo, B. Batsu CvS: Cammy, EX Yuri, EX Beni, Dhaslim CvS2: (Still undecided, but current team) Eagle, Rock, Hauhmoru or R4 Blanka or Haohmoru GGX: Venom or Zato-1 Posted by ss on August 29th, 2001 04:51 AM: quote: Originally posted by ID The game is dead, fool. Only at your area, maybe... Here, there are still usually 10/15 people around the MvC2 cabinet while 4 to 6 are around the CvS2. Live with it. Posted by ss on August 29th, 2001 04:52 AM: white, if I do counter ahvb against a mag/psy player, mags will NEED to block it while I kill psylocke, or can he escape from it? Posted by ID on August 29th, 2001 06:10 AM: hehe..you're just belaying the inevitable. maybe you guys in small states are getting a kick out of the game cause your best character has been spiderman, but once the major tournaments stop..once the hype stops..once the hotspots stop playing it..once srk starts covering CvS2 way way more, MvC2 will die. Enjoy it all you can, hehe. Westwood sucks, dude..Noone but SCRUBS play there. Its fun owning scrubs an all , Like LB here, but after a while, it just gets boring. The only place i've seen garou is golflands an college arcade, an college arcade took it out. And as for the thread..Storm/sakura/doom. Runaway storm, build 4 meters, doom+hailstorm, DHC transform, teleport for 70 seconds. Ohhhh yeah. __________________ http://www.diskreet.com "HELP ME CUZ HELP ME PLEASE" Posted by cheese_master on August 29th, 2001 12:38 PM: quote: Originally posted by ss white, if I do counter ahvb against a mag/psy player, mags will NEED to block it while I kill psylocke, or can he escape from it? Not if Magneto gets hit by the scimitar... then he can airdash and land behind you and wait to see if u DHC (if u have a safe one like the hailstorm) and if u don't he can rape u. __________________ A bum asks a man for two dollars. The man says, "If I give you the money, will you just use it to buy booze?" The bum says no. The man asks, "Will you spend it off in the arcade?" The bum says no. Then the man asks, "Then will you come home with me so my wife can see what happens to a man who doesn’t drink or play videogames?" Posted by Eric Magnus on August 29th, 2001 03:18 PM: Oh well, every time some "MvC2 God" quits, new people come in to take their places. CvS2 doesn't excite me any more than CvS did. Which is 0. I'll probalby buy it and play it, but not like MvC2. Oh, BTW, nobody here in our gay little "small state" uses spiderman, either. __________________ Team Sandusky: As soon as we get in a tourney we'll pipe down. Brian Holdren - Storm/Cammy/Doom Roger Hartzell - Magneto/Cable/Ken Joe Gill - Sent/Cable/Cyke Posted by Chaotic Blue on August 29th, 2001 06:41 PM: quote: Originally posted by Eric Magnus Oh well, every time some "MvC2 God" quits, new people come in to take their places. CvS2 doesn't excite me any more than CvS did. Which is 0. I'll probalby buy it and play it, but not like MvC2. Oh, BTW, nobody here in our gay little "small state" uses spiderman, either. i hate to say it but CvS2 is kinda fun but its still based on the same principul that CvS was. really really reallly reallly slow. I still play MvC2, its still fun i guess so i guess then it hasn't died yet. i guess. C. Blue __________________ Typical James Games Tournament. Crazy Gideon: "Peter Rosas to machine 1!" Me: "Dude he's already playing" Crazy Gideon: "I know, he is disqualified. Next will be Mike Hunt vrs Mike Hawk." ... "Mike Hawk was taken from Mike Hunt, Mike Hunt is the winner!" Posted by Smiley on August 29th, 2001 10:23 PM: quote: Originally posted by ID hehe..you're just belaying the inevitable. maybe you guys in small states are getting a kick out of the game cause your best character has been spiderman, but once the major tournaments stop..once the hype stops..once the hotspots stop playing it..once srk starts covering CvS2 way way more, MvC2 will die. Enjoy it all you can, hehe. Westwood sucks, dude..Noone but SCRUBS play there. Its fun owning scrubs an all , Like LB here, but after a while, it just gets boring. The only place i've seen garou is golflands an college arcade, an college arcade took it out. And as for the thread..Storm/sakura/doom. Runaway storm, build 4 meters, doom+hailstorm, DHC transform, teleport for 70 seconds. Ohhhh yeah. can you dhc into a transformation? that would rock... __________________ When in doubt, Cheese 'em out! -Last words of Smiley, before becoming a grateful scrub Posted by DaBomb963 on August 30th, 2001 12:39 AM: Mabe now people will stop critising me for always useing sakura... __________________ Every moment gives us an opportunity to be come better than we already are! -RYU Posted by FluffyXXL on August 30th, 2001 02:45 AM: quote: Originally posted by Smiley can you dhc into a transformation? that would rock... No you can't. About the only thing you can do is cancel a special move with it. You can use a variable counter to counter to her Shou'ou Ken and cancel that with the transformation as soon as your opponent gets hit up before you leave the ground. It's free at that point, but in order for her to be unbeatable, you'd have to be in the lead, get 4 meters, and be able to teleport perfectly the rest of the match. __________________ FluffyXXL -Retired as of 8/5/01 -Comeback planned for 9/13/01 Posted by Rollchan on August 30th, 2001 02:46 AM: For some reason DHC transform doens't work for me. __________________ Konaide! Posted by Cornelius on August 30th, 2001 03:01 AM: Maybe White can clear all this Sakura strategizing strategery up. But I do have some ideas of what she would like. Sakura's team should be battery/Sakura/assist team. The two that stand out are Storm/Doom and Spiral/Sent. The reason for the chip is because, if this porting trick works, she can drop a chipper, port away, drop chipper, etc. This essentialy means free chip damage for the rest of the match once you get into Evil Sak mode. So Sak can be losing by maybe half a lifebar and still win. However, if Sakura's battery dies, Regular Sak/assist doesn't sound too hot. Regular Sak has a nice AC, though...Launch /\ jab XX cane kick (doesn't cause FS, still in superjump arc) short XX rushing DP. Question: Did White even mention evil Sak? Posted by ss on August 30th, 2001 03:50 AM: quote: Originally posted by ID hehe..you're just belaying the inevitable. maybe you guys in small states are getting a kick out of the game cause your best character has been spiderman, but once the major tournaments stop..once the hype stops..once the hotspots stop playing it..once srk starts covering CvS2 way way more, MvC2 will die. Enjoy it all you can, hehe. Westwood sucks, dude..Noone but SCRUBS play there. Its fun owning scrubs an all , Like LB here, but after a while, it just gets boring. The only place i've seen garou is golflands an college arcade, an college arcade took it out. And as for the thread..Storm/sakura/doom. Runaway storm, build 4 meters, doom+hailstorm, DHC transform, teleport for 70 seconds. Ohhhh yeah. Yeah, NY is small... Whatever... And against high level teams as spiral/cable/sent or strider/doom/comm it's almost impossible to storm battery to four levels and still holds the lead. Evil Sakura will teleport for 70 seconds and then lose the game by time. work your tactics. Posted by ss on August 30th, 2001 03:52 AM: quote: Originally posted by cheese_master Not if Magneto gets hit by the scimitar... then he can airdash and land behind you and wait to see if u DHC (if u have a safe one like the hailstorm) and if u don't he can rape u. But considering that cable will cancel into ahvb off the 2nd(I think) hit of the psimitar and aim up wouldn't magneto be low enough to not have time to air dash out before the ahvb catches him? Thanks alot for your answer! Posted by ID on August 30th, 2001 04:04 AM: quote: Originally posted by ss Yeah, NY is small... Whatever... And against high level teams as spiral/cable/sent or strider/doom/comm it's almost impossible to storm battery to four levels and still holds the lead. Evil Sakura will teleport for 70 seconds and then lose the game by time. work your tactics. Uh, yeah I was speaking litterally. A joke? Whats that? *couSCRUBgh* __________________ http://www.diskreet.com "HELP ME CUZ HELP ME PLEASE" Posted by AK on August 30th, 2001 05:33 AM: Re: MvsC2 ranking by Japanese quote: Originally posted by white #(IMO 1-5) Sakura, Strider, Dhalsim, Spiral, Blackheart It is impossible to make accurate ranking, but I think this ranking reflects most Japanese player's opinion. I will not comment with each character because whether one can win or not is depend on player's skill. But I just want to say Sakura in MVC2 is better than her in A3. Sorry I am quite busy now. I would like to post more later. -white Definitely interesting, but all of the points people brought up are true... if you meant E. sakura. You still need 3 levels to transform her, you need perfect execution if you are gonna teleport all day and escape traps. I've seen teleport happy e. sakura's, usually dropping doom-b where they will appear or throwing them as they appear work best... of course if they have perfect execution, they can avoid both situations. Maybe there's something the japanese know about sakura that the US doesn't, or maybe this is 'dhalsim hype' all over again... Posted by Limp_Bizkit666 on August 30th, 2001 06:18 AM: ID likes men.. just cause i rape his ass with amingo, he gets jealous and starts to scream mvc2's death... well, in southern cali, it's almost dead. KOF gets more play than mvc2 at GOLFLAND. =[ oh well... a lot of us still play that game, (like me) because we became competitive starting from that game. (like me) it's like your first tricycle, you know? you know you have to move on to a bicycle, but it saddens u in the heart to give it up for something better... cvs is dead. mvc2 WILL follow soon. it's not dead "yet", but it will. cvs2 is alive and well, and it's gonna be big. too bad it's gonna be another game where turtle wins over rushdown. =[ GAY laterz __________________ Rags Under Nads... that's what you'll smell like when you piss on your pants. ----- oh, and do you know cactus? cactus who? STFU! Posted by Kenny on August 30th, 2001 06:52 AM: I tried E.Sakura's teleport today....... I teleported right into War Machines Proton Cannon super.......and i was able to block it once i came out of the teleport!!!!....i was like what the heck..... As for building meter for the transformation, i'm thinking of magneto or Iron Man.....use the rejump infinite to build the meter and to put u in the lead........and i'm pretty sure u can DHC into transformation. I've seen Zangief do it before.....and i think i did it this morning using sakura too but i don't remember. tactics.......right now i'm thinking of running away with E.Sakura or just teleport up close and keep calling out Assist, cross ups...etc anyways, can Akuma do the same thing with his teleport??? Posted by SSF2T on August 30th, 2001 08:15 AM: quote: Originally posted by Kenny anyways, can Akuma do the same thing with his teleport??? No. Akuma/Gouki seems to have a longer stall time after his teleport. Sakura has no/very little stall time because it requires a lvl. 3 to get to that form... so Capcom decided to give her an advantage. Akuma/Gouki doesn't need to transform... so he has to have an disadvantage. Which is the stall time. __________________ "FATAL FURY 2" [Terry Bogard] If you're really good, then you wouldn't need to pick on guys weaker than you are. Posted by cheese_master on August 30th, 2001 12:51 PM: quote: Originally posted by Gilliam oh i see, well the only game that CvS2 is gonna kill is CvS. WTF? Doesn't something have to be alive for it to be killed? CvS fucking died the moment they plugged it into the wall. __________________ A bum asks a man for two dollars. The man says, "If I give you the money, will you just use it to buy booze?" The bum says no. The man asks, "Will you spend it off in the arcade?" The bum says no. Then the man asks, "Then will you come home with me so my wife can see what happens to a man who doesn’t drink or play videogames?" Posted by ID on August 30th, 2001 03:32 PM: quote: Originally posted by Limp_Bizkit666 ID likes men.. just cause i rape his ass with amingo, he gets jealous and starts to scream mvc2's death... You only wish it were so. I know you get lonely. __________________ http://www.diskreet.com "HELP ME CUZ HELP ME PLEASE" Posted by Eric Magnus on August 30th, 2001 05:11 PM: INTARNET FIGHT!@$!$#@$!@ If only Amingo were playable... I had a lot of problems with Nicholas D. Wolfwood's magnus the other night... he's really learning thos mags combos. I agree that Doom is top-tier... he's just so versatile. LK in the air has tons of priority too... or, at least it beats mags' lp in the air. Gotta be above them tho. __________________ Team Sandusky: As soon as we get in a tourney we'll pipe down. Brian Holdren - Storm/Cammy/Doom Roger Hartzell - Magneto/Cable/Ken Joe Gill - Sent/Cable/Cyke Posted by Gilliam on August 30th, 2001 05:29 PM: quote: Originally posted by cheese_master WTF? Doesn't something have to be alive for it to be killed? CvS fucking died the moment they plugged it into the wall. lol you do have a point. __________________ Bonerine owns u all!!!! teams that i'm fucking around with morrigan/sent storm/tron bonerine/sent/blackheart R.I.P Aaliyah your music was the shit and you were and still are my fav female artist Posted by Nicholas D Wolfwood on August 30th, 2001 10:10 PM: quote: Originally posted by Eric Magnus INTARNET FIGHT!@$!$#@$!@ If only Amingo were playable... I had a lot of problems with Nicholas D. Wolfwood's magnus the other night... he's really learning thos mags combos. I agree that Doom is top-tier... he's just so versatile. LK in the air has tons of priority too... or, at least it beats mags' lp in the air. Gotta be above them tho. ya i kicked your butt jk, im pretty Posted by Nicholas D Wolfwood on August 30th, 2001 10:13 PM: quote: Originally posted by SSF2T Akuma/Gouki doesn't need to transform... so he has to have an disadvantage. Which is the stall time. AND THE FACT THAT HE HAS THE WORST VITALITY IN THE GAME and dont say anything about roll or kobun having worse vitality. they aernt even playable! Posted by BlackShinobi on August 30th, 2001 10:57 PM: I'd just like to say again that Evil Sakura is a good fighting character using her just to teleport is selling her extremely short. __________________ I get to call Juggernaut a fat piece of shit because I use him. That's the rule. R.I.P Baby Girl Posted by TexMex on August 31st, 2001 02:13 AM: interesting thread. wonder if white is gonna post again soon. __________________ Show me a guy with one foot, and I'll show you a guy who tried to hide his money in his shoe... Posted by ss on August 31st, 2001 03:46 AM: quote: Originally posted by ID Uh, yeah I was speaking litterally. A joke? Whats that? *couSCRUBgh* So tell me one single game at a tourney(not even a match, not even the finals) where a famous Storm player won against a famous spiral/cable/sent or strider/doom/comm player WITHOUT CHANGING characters until storm reaches 4 levels. This simply doesn't happen. Justin plays her using DHCs very often to get the lead as soon as he can. Ricky uses her almost always AFTER cable, to get the advantage from the DHC. Same for Tone. Same for all mag/storm players as cobofiend, sanford, justin, duc and valle. Do you really believe that Storm, without use a single special(which means she'll have to land lots of weak combos to kill anyone, and having only one top assist, since sakura is the other) will get the lead against an equally skilled player playing spiral/cable/sent or strider/doom/comm? I would like to see that. Against strider/doom/commando, by the time she got 4 levels, unless she landed 3 clean hits all by herself(hard against a character with doom and commando on the back), she'll be dead. It seems that you're joking, not me. Storm uses DHC teams to win, or came in second to have her DHC out, or have a good VC partner to prevent the opponent for chipping. Do you want to use a Storm without Hail chipping, without lightning storm combos, without VC power and iwthout 2 good assists to get teh lead against teh best teams in the nation? Good luck then, to win B6 with Sakura... Posted by G.Bonne on August 31st, 2001 05:04 AM: perfection is everything.... anyone can charge 4 meters without loosing the fight. once u get there perfect teleport execution and you win. peace. __________________ Loco...hablando claro,el chipote chillon del kobun de tron esta cool...como que te coje y te jodes porque es un leguito pero se convierte en grande y tu no te das cuenta no sabes lo que esta pasando el leguito esta roleando y si convierte en fucking MECCA LEGO...cabron, te gane. Posted by ID on August 31st, 2001 06:13 AM: quote: Originally posted by ss Storm uses DHC teams to win, or came in second to have her DHC out, or have a good VC partner to prevent the opponent for chipping. Do you want to use a Storm without Hail chipping, without lightning storm combos, without VC power and iwthout 2 good assists to get teh lead against teh best teams in the nation? Good luck then, to win B6 with Sakura... Uh..If I land a combo on strider, i'm not gonna not super to save meters..duh. If you can get the damage, go for it. Just conserve meters, so no random chipping hailstorms, an such. Justin only DHCs if the combo connects, and hey, if you can land a combo, an kill strider..why the fuck would you conserve meters? And as for naming one tourney..that was the point i didnt give the explanation of what i meant, i was gonna UL the peter vs clockw0rk match from a golfland tourney, so i wouldnt have to explain all this. __________________ http://www.diskreet.com "HELP ME CUZ HELP ME PLEASE" Posted by Limp_Bizkit666 on August 31st, 2001 06:23 AM: quote: Originally posted by ID Uh..If I land a combo on strider, i'm not gonna not super to save meters..duh. If you can get the damage, go for it. Just conserve meters, so no random chipping hailstorms, an such. Justin only DHCs if the combo connects, and hey, if you can land a combo, an kill strider..why the fuck would you conserve meters? And as for naming one tourney..that was the point i didnt give the explanation of what i meant, i was gonna UL the peter vs clockw0rk match from a golfland tourney, so i wouldnt have to explain all this. i had this greeat comeback, but the 12 post DAILY limit, and my not-so-great long-term memory span, rendered it useless... u suck.. a lot yeah...... uh, .... yeah.. __________________ Rags Under Nads... that's what you'll smell like when you piss on your pants. ----- oh, and do you know cactus? cactus who? STFU! Posted by ID on August 31st, 2001 07:01 AM: hah See why i made "ID II"? And keep on talking, and pretty soon, your family will be celebrating YOUR death on fridays. __________________ http://www.diskreet.com "HELP ME CUZ HELP ME PLEASE" Posted by Eric Magnus on August 31st, 2001 12:29 PM: quote: Originally posted by Nicholas D Wolfwood ya i kicked your butt jk, im pretty Wait a minute, why are you still talking about MvC2? Don't you know that MVC2 IS DAED!?!?!!? Go practice yo' Rock Howard and Hibiki, foo! Yes I do indeed hope white responds soon to dispel all of our speculation and reveal exactly why he ranked Sak up there (although we all assume it has something to do with that teleport). To me, the "land one hit, teleport for 99 seconds" idea will work about as good as the Strider/Doom trap; if you can execute it 100% perfectly EVERY time with a perfect controller or something, yes in theory, on paper, it could work. Of course, I have yet to see anyone, anywhere do a perfect Strider/Doom, so I doubt I'd ever see a perfect Sak. Posted by ID on August 31st, 2001 02:04 PM: Oh, Oh, Your Sarcasm changes EVERYTHING. Obviously, I was mistaken..Scrubs like you are still playing MvC2 against each other, However could it be dead? Tournaments? pfft, since when do they matter. __________________ http://www.diskreet.com "HELP ME CUZ HELP ME PLEASE" Posted by Eric Magnus on August 31st, 2001 02:24 PM: EDIT: I really don't have time to bicker back and forth with you. I had a great big post here, and deleted it to save myself the utter boredom of constantly replying to someone with a geographically-induced superiority complex. Now if you'd mind keeping your ego out of this thread, us little scrubbies were discussing a dead game. Exit, stage CvS2. __________________ Team Sandusky: As soon as we get in a tourney we'll pipe down. Brian Holdren - Storm/Cammy/Doom Roger Hartzell - Magneto/Cable/Ken Joe Gill - Sent/Cable/Cyke Posted by Limp_Bizkit666 on August 31st, 2001 05:59 PM: quote: Originally posted by ID hah See why i made "ID II"? And keep on talking, and pretty soon, your family will be celebrating YOUR death on fridays. hehe maybe i should make, B-Otch4u2 or something. =] oh well... __________________ Rags Under Nads... that's what you'll smell like when you piss on your pants. ----- oh, and do you know cactus? cactus who? STFU! Posted by Chaotic Blue on August 31st, 2001 06:05 PM: the basis of viscants and wongs storm teams is the 100% dhc which invlolves 3 meters, they usually build these meters pretty quick, just take a look and thats how they win. Don't say it real hard to get 3 meters especially with magneto. whats that like 2 incomplete combos? aka 5 clock seconds. <-exaggeration. *better put that there* c. blue __________________ Typical James Games Tournament. Crazy Gideon: "Peter Rosas to machine 1!" Me: "Dude he's already playing" Crazy Gideon: "I know, he is disqualified. Next will be Mike Hunt vrs Mike Hawk." ... "Mike Hawk was taken from Mike Hunt, Mike Hunt is the winner!" Posted by Nicholas D Wolfwood on August 31st, 2001 07:33 PM: quote: Originally posted by ID Oh, Oh, Your Sarcasm changes EVERYTHING. Obviously, I was mistaken..Scrubs like you are still playing MvC2 against each other, However could it be dead? Tournaments? pfft, since when do they matter. Posted by ID on August 31st, 2001 07:40 PM: quote: Originally posted by Eric Magnus EDIT: I really don't have time to bicker back and forth with you. I had a great big post here, and deleted it to save myself the utter boredom of constantly replying to someone with a geographically-induced superiority complex. Now if you'd mind keeping your ego out of this thread, us little scrubbies were discussing a dead game. Exit, stage CvS2. Oh, well in that case, I hade a whole post here, Proving you 100% wrong, without, ANY doubt. but i deleted it.. Ororo, i'll be at WW from 2 on..think we can fit mike in? I already invited him..dunno if he'll bring his camera, tho. I didnt know peter was coming..bleh. __________________ http://www.diskreet.com "HELP ME CUZ HELP ME PLEASE" Posted by Wizard6 on August 31st, 2001 09:11 PM: he he he !!! __________________ Puerto Rico Rules !!!!! Team Harcore Forever !!! Posted by rusbar on September 1st, 2001 02:07 AM: i swear, too many people out here care too much about the teirs. it's like your holy bible or something. __________________ bettah call me BUTTAH. . .cuz i'm onna ROLL! Posted by fateXd2 on September 1st, 2001 04:06 AM: I personally think he wrote it just to cause controversy __________________ How are KFC and a woman alike? After the breasts and thighs all you have is a greasy bucket to put your bone in Posted by ID on September 1st, 2001 08:12 AM: quote: Originally posted by rusbar i swear, too many people out here care too much about the teirs. it's like your holy bible or something. Tiers arent something made up overnight..they're based over many tournaments, and 'top' tier have been proven to be the best. Ofcourse..half the people dont understand that..they're like, okay, white says sakura's top tier..if i pick her, i'm gonna win for sure. __________________ http://www.diskreet.com "HELP ME CUZ HELP ME PLEASE" Posted by PikaPuff on September 1st, 2001 10:19 AM: quote: Originally posted by Nicholas D Wolfwood and dont say anything about roll or kobun having worse vitality. they aernt even playable! WTF... *goes back to reading posts* .... read the quote, read it! ha, in all my suckdom of using sakura for the past two years, i only double tp'ed through a beam once ^^;... green abyss' IM wannabe beam. could never get the timing again. sakura's projectile assist can guard break, like that matters... her dash assist can punish some jump based traps *cough*bh*cough* hurricane kick glitched. also the arc gets over some specific traps... the hk hk(hurricane kick >.< ) hits dr doom out of aaa testing- assist, teleport may guard break anywhere on screen (yes i'm a stupid srcub) testing- down+hp repeatedly can work as battery, cancel into teleport against any retailation. the transformation is EASILY AHVB'able (it happens to me a lot, trust me) the transformation is NOT DHC'able.. i've tried... for months (but i AM a scrub after all, i can be wrong) after the combo into air throw, in corner, it's otg'able, out of corner it's dark sakura shinkuu hadoken'able... depends on how stupid the person is at rolling ^^; has some basic needs... overhead, air stalling, air horizontal movement, anti air, trap stopping, mind games, glitches, um... supers... >.> at SHGL tron gamma+shinkuu hadoken is more than 50%, but i'm damn sure that's not a reason why she's top tier. still don't think sakura's top tier... anyhoo it is mostly dependant on skill, i'm basing sakura's tier on my skills of playing her for years... and I SUCK. japn on the other hand... in my sterotypical/racist mind, i can see why japan would pick a japanese schoolgirl character a lot... and after played a lot, can be learned to be very good, and turned top tier. then again, i thought morrigan was top tier in japan for the same reason, but i don't see her anywhere up there. and notice how in the US the guy with the big ass gun in #1... *cough* in all my scrubiness, sakura tp is easily counter by a regular throw dash/dodge storm tornado's, tp through hailstorm... dash under dr doom keep aways... tp through cable... hurricane dr doom aaa... damn, gotta think of good team mates for her.. i probably make her suck since i always use a bad team up with her.... __________________ --- Roll(a/g)/Servebot(g)/T.Bonne(g): "3% Wins and going strong!" Jill/Sakura/T.Bonne: "Mags Rushdown? Zombie that shit... 'X' Trap? Hiyakeshita Sakura Tp that shit." Posted by iRoNMaN!|LiU| on September 1st, 2001 02:21 PM: d00d some of these guyz truly are scrubz. They hang on every word u say. Nothing wrong with you white, but some people are dumb. Anyways, Nice rankings, I can see what ur talking about with the characters. Im surprised u put Cable in the top, most japanese people dont use him. o well. __________________ "I'm Unstoppable!" Posted by ss on September 2nd, 2001 05:49 AM: quote: Originally posted by G.Bonne perfection is everything.... anyone can charge 4 meters without loosing the fight. once u get there perfect teleport execution and you win. peace. You mean 4 meters keeping the lead, right? Otherwise you'll teleport perfectly to lose by time, like I said. If the opponnet can use supers and you can't, who's got tha advantage to got the lead? Posted by ss on September 2nd, 2001 05:54 AM: quote: Originally posted by ID Uh..If I land a combo on strider, i'm not gonna not super to save meters..duh. If you can get the damage, go for it. Just conserve meters, so no random chipping hailstorms, an such. Justin only DHCs if the combo connects, and hey, if you can land a combo, an kill strider..why the fuck would you conserve meters? And as for naming one tourney..that was the point i didnt give the explanation of what i meant, i was gonna UL the peter vs clockw0rk match from a golfland tourney, so i wouldnt have to explain all this. If you'll using your supers(which is of course the smartest thing to do) you'll be playing with a sucker assist on the #2 spot(Sakura) and taking the risk of having a sucker character when your main dies(Sakura). It's still the best thing to do, but isn't better to just throw Sakura out and have a Sent or Doom in there? At the match you're talking about he guy really won with Sakura? I gotta see that, but even if it happened, it's one in a million. And I bet it was with Magneto. Magneto can kill fast without super and got the lead(or can die and fuck your entire team) . Even that, I don't think it worths to trade Storm's DHC, assist and runaway(only in the case you really got the lead with meters, only situation while Sakura will be better) for a hope to get the lead and lots of meters with only one top tier. Posted by ss on September 2nd, 2001 05:59 AM: quote: Originally posted by Chaotic Blue the basis of viscants and wongs storm teams is the 100% dhc which invlolves 3 meters, they usually build these meters pretty quick, just take a look and thats how they win. Don't say it real hard to get 3 meters especially with magneto. whats that like 2 incomplete combos? aka 5 clock seconds. <-exaggeration. *better put that there* c. blue You have to got 4 meters and the lead to bring E. Sakura safely. Everyone can do meters, but not everyone can get the lead. Now let's say you're playing mags/sakura/psylocke against mags/storm or cable/psy(conventional teams). The opp will have a much better assist and DHC if Storm or the deadly CAHVB if Cable. He have better chances to get the lead, and Sakura will be almost hopeless after it. Your bet is to out play the opps magneto(even him having a better buildt team) and than runaway for the rest of the match. If you can outplay him this way, you definitely don't need Sakura, you can win faster with a better team. I think the only situation where E. Sak would be good is if you have a fantastic magneto and totally sucks with Sent, Storm, Cable and the others, so you want to do whatever you want with mags and run later, cause otherwise you can't win. I don't think much layers are like that. Posted by KungfuJoe on September 2nd, 2001 06:53 AM: White needs to give some info on why Sakura is tops because I can't see how she is. __________________ It's not that we are better than everyone. Its just that everyone else is dumber. Posted by DeathFromAbove on September 2nd, 2001 08:23 AM: You take a perfectly decent post...and sticky it. And then you get 8,000,000,000 bullshit responses. -DFA ...make that 8,000,000,001 __________________ Insert witty comment here. Posted by HyperViperSniper on September 2nd, 2001 10:37 PM: how many Sakuras did you guys see in the top 5 rankings @ B5? oh wait..none..thats why..she might be good when you are playing with half assed top tier skills..but against people that KNOW how to use Top Tier Sakura is far from a threat... how many Dhalsims and Iron Mans did we see in the finals? nuff said..just like I said before..the existing top tiers in this game are already established..adding some character because they have a level 3 transformation doesnt make them top tier.. yeah shes got a bad ass teleport but who wants to teleport into an AHVB anyway? that is just total nonsense.. HVS __________________ Check out the new revolution in gaming..the ECG site NEW FORUMS and BETTER gaming Service http://ecgamers.get-2.com Posted by Chaap on September 2nd, 2001 11:20 PM: Too much theory. Sakura isn't top 5. __________________ Some people are just dumb. Posted by Smiley on September 2nd, 2001 11:49 PM: quote: Originally posted by HyperViperSniper how many Sakuras did you guys see in the top 5 rankings @ B5? oh wait..none..thats why..she might be good when you are playing with half assed top tier skills..but against people that KNOW how to use Top Tier Sakura is far from a threat... how many Dhalsims and Iron Mans did we see in the finals? nuff said..just like I said before..the existing top tiers in this game are already established..adding some character because they have a level 3 transformation doesnt make them top tier.. yeah shes got a bad ass teleport but who wants to teleport into an AHVB anyway? that is just total nonsense.. HVS whoa there bud, relax. don't take one tourney as an example. there were what? 5 japanese players out of 300 something ppl there? the whole point of this thread is to tell everyone what WHITE AND THE OTHER JAPANESE players thought of the top tier. if it was a japanese tourney, then i'll assume that you see plenty of sakuras. along with alot of sonsons and thanoses too. so basically, taking B5 into consideration against what the japanese thought of the tiers is totally wrong. but IF sak did win the tourney, does that make her top? i dunno... would it? i didn't see any striders in the top teams, does taht mean he sucks too? the point is that you shouldn't take the results of one tourney and apply it to the tiers. tourneys rank people, not characters. now personally, i don't think sakura is top either, but hey, whit'e's one of the best jap players, so i guess his advice is as good as viscant's when referring to the way the japaneses play. __________________ When in doubt, Cheese 'em out! -Last words of Smiley, before becoming a grateful scrub Posted by Smiley on September 2nd, 2001 11:50 PM: one more thing, you WOULD want to teleport into an AHVB if you knew how to teleport OUT of it as well, w/o getting hit, of course. __________________ When in doubt, Cheese 'em out! -Last words of Smiley, before becoming a grateful scrub Posted by Aoishi2AL on September 3rd, 2001 06:31 PM: White always posts and leaves. He is such a good person. __________________ ........................................ Posted by Chris F on September 3rd, 2001 07:35 PM: You cannot DHC into Sakura's transformation. There is only one legitimate Sakura team which is Spiral/Sakura/Sentinel. Phase one is obviously not get killed or snapped out w. Spiral, and try to get level 5. Safe tag Sakura (this is what Liquidmetal did at B5). There are many ways of safely transforming. Once you have accomplished this, you must understand that E.Sak teleporting with Spiral-a and Sentinel-y, is nothing to laugh about. Having a japanese joystick gives you the opportunity to do perfect uppercut motions and double button presses. American buttons, it is easy to understand that Sakura is very risky to use, as most teleport screwups are disastrous. Cable cannot AHVB a blocked E.Sak super fireball. E.Sak super fireball does RIDICULOUS damage to a helper. Often in the 50% range. If you can double teleport flawlessly (don't think for a second that there isn't someone in Japan who can't do this, there will be), and use the Sentinel drone or Spiral knives assist in their correct situations, you will force the enemy to superjump all the time cause if you don't jump, you're going to get locked down by st.RH + Spiral assist XX teleport a lot. Screw up a block on the ground and you'll eat chain into st. RH XX fireball XX super fireball. Sak's obviously weak in the air, but can at least rain FB's and has the ability to move horizontally. I don't think Sakura can be considered tops in the US, because of the joysticks. Even with Japanese sticks it isn't the world's greatest strategy but you just never know these days. White isn't a dumb guy, so I'm willing to wait for his explanation because everyone I've showed this stuff to admits it has some potential. It's a case of requiring a lot of knowledge regarding when you can call the assist, when to teleport, and obviously above all, perfect execution. In the case of characters like Ironman and Dhalsim, the 'hardware' does have an impact. It is not very difficult to perform the Japanese Ironman infinite setup on a real Japanese arcade stick. Kit (Magnetic Boy) at Odakyu in Richmond B.C. (which uses Jap sticks) performs it at 100% efficiency. He himself admits to being not so great at Ironman in general, but his ability to pull this off every single time (White also does it 100%), makes a difference. __________________ Death to Monsanto. Posted by The Prophet on September 3rd, 2001 08:01 PM: Christ...are you guys still worshipping the supposed greatness of Sakura? Get over it. Sakura has never been a dominating force in the tournament scene of MvsC2 (whereas Cable, Sentinel, etc. definitely are.) Until I see tournament results where Sakuras are showing up in the top 3 or 5 finalist teams she'll be IMHO another lofty dream. I find it funny how all it takes is one Japanese guy giving Sakura top tier status and suddenly everyone comes out of the woodwork with their Sakura stories. She'll never be a contender with the likes of Storm and Sentinel. She'll never make a huge impact at US tournaments. She'll never be considered a threat the way Cable is. I know I sound a bit harsh here...I honestly don't intend to attack or flame anyone. Opinions are opinions. But MHO is you're all wasting your time with all this Sakura discussion. It would be different if the subject thread was "Fun and Effective Strategies with Lower-Tier Characters," but that is not the case here. C'mon let's be serious..."Sakura" and "top-tier" in the same sentence? Maybe...if the words "Never gonna happen" appear in the sentence too. __________________ The Prophet "Like lambs to the slaughter" - Apocalypse Posted by Ouroborus on September 3rd, 2001 08:50 PM: quote: Originally posted by Chris F You cannot DHC into Sakura's transformation. There is only one legitimate Sakura team which is Spiral/Sakura/Sentinel. Phase one is obviously not get killed or snapped out w. Spiral, and try to get level 5. Safe tag Sakura (this is what Liquidmetal did at B5). There are many ways of safely transforming. Once you have accomplished this, you must understand that E.Sak teleporting with Spiral-a and Sentinel-y, is nothing to laugh about. Having a japanese joystick gives you the opportunity to do perfect uppercut motions and double button presses. American buttons, it is easy to understand that Sakura is very risky to use, as most teleport screwups are disastrous. Cable cannot AHVB a blocked E.Sak super fireball. E.Sak super fireball does RIDICULOUS damage to a helper. Often in the 50% range. If you can double teleport flawlessly (don't think for a second that there isn't someone in Japan who can't do this, there will be), and use the Sentinel drone or Spiral knives assist in their correct situations, you will force the enemy to superjump all the time cause if you don't jump, you're going to get locked down by st.RH + Spiral assist XX teleport a lot. Screw up a block on the ground and you'll eat chain into st. RH XX fireball XX super fireball. Sak's obviously weak in the air, but can at least rain FB's and has the ability to move horizontally. I don't think Sakura can be considered tops in the US, because of the joysticks. Even with Japanese sticks it isn't the world's greatest strategy but you just never know these days. White isn't a dumb guy, so I'm willing to wait for his explanation because everyone I've showed this stuff to admits it has some potential. It's a case of requiring a lot of knowledge regarding when you can call the assist, when to teleport, and obviously above all, perfect execution. In the case of characters like Ironman and Dhalsim, the 'hardware' does have an impact. It is not very difficult to perform the Japanese Ironman infinite setup on a real Japanese arcade stick. Kit (Magnetic Boy) at Odakyu in Richmond B.C. (which uses Jap sticks) performs it at 100% efficiency. He himself admits to being not so great at Ironman in general, but his ability to pull this off every single time (White also does it 100%), makes a difference. Controllers doesn't do shit to make Sakura, IM, or Dhalsim better. Its all about getting used to. The infinite is just as easy to do on American sticks. __________________ You must defeat Doom to stand a chance - Strider Hiryu Posted by Chris F on September 3rd, 2001 09:01 PM: Prophet: Your opinion is noted and valid. Sakura will probably never be top tier in the US. however, it isn't a waste of time to discuss her though. That is a very elitist thing to say. It is completeley worthwhile to discuss Sakura strategies under this thread, rather than come up with a different thread altogether. White ignited a lot of discussion with his rankings, and people are anxiously waiting for him to back his ranking of her up with something that we haven't heard before. While the US is definitely way ahead of Japan in terms of MVC2 strategy, Japan is clearly superior in technical mastery of characters in nearly all Capcom games. Maybe there's a glitch that they've found; White hasn't said a word since. It is proven that Sakura's teleport has no vulnerable recovery. Who are we to say that some Japanese Sakura players can perform infinite chained teleports flawlessly? Such a player would no question, without a doubt, be using the best character in MVC2. White expressed great interest in holding a future USA vs. Japan event IN JAPAN, as he also regretted the inability for the other top Japanese players to attend B5. Anyone at B5 could tell that White very well could have placed even higher than he did. Now with added experience under his belt, he is even more dangerous this time. If other players are as good as White or better, at their respective characters, it is not unreasonable to think that some Sakura players in Japan use her to her maximum potential, which is something nobody in the US can claim to do. __________________ Death to Monsanto. Posted by The Prophet on September 3rd, 2001 09:55 PM: Chris F - all good points. I have some additional comments... First of all my rant was moreso playing Devil's Advocate than anything else...even though I firmly believe Sakura will never become a character of dominance in the US (and yes I could be wrong...it would be far more interesting if I was wrong too.) But as for the Japanese vs US, in both the US vs Japan tournament and B5 it would be somewhat accurate to say the US cleaned up. The Japanese got rocked at the tournament in Japan...at B5 they failed to make a hugh impact (huge impact - place as 1st 2nd or 3rd.) They got 2 chances to outshine the US at MvsC2, and failed to do so both times. How many more chances are we going to give them? Face it, this Dream Tournament between all the best US and all the best Japanese players is never going to happen. There will always be people who cannot attend, always some who dislike the sticks, etc. MvsC2 is bound to become less and less popular as time goes on (if Capcom vs SNK 2 is as good as it's shaping up to be we may have a new #1 game.) I think it's safe to say the US is #1 in MvsC2. I'm sure the Japanese players are very good, with their Iron Man infinites and Evil Sakura teleport tricks, but history has shown the US to be the better players...twice. __________________ The Prophet "Like lambs to the slaughter" - Apocalypse Posted by Chris F on September 3rd, 2001 11:42 PM: I have a feeling that the japanese players might still not understand the game. The only player at B5 who was good was white, but his post b5 rankings are still puzzling. Maybe it's translation speed but I think he owes people a detailed explanation of his rankings much like the way viscant did. To rate Sakura #1 in both rankings and not explain, well, he's asking for it. Maybe the Japanese can somehow sponsor the top 3 or 4 guys the States have, for a made for TV event or something, like how they did that 3-on-3 team thingy for A3. __________________ Death to Monsanto. Posted by blt on September 4th, 2001 12:39 AM: you scrubs are still posting? white hasn't even responded yet. why doesnt everyone just be quiet and wait for the response. oh yea one more thing , to all the random scrubs talking jazz about japanese skills. white held it down at b5. he did real good. do you know who he lost to.. JUSTIN WONG and ALEX VALLE were his two losses in the tournament.. now how many of you wouldn't have lost there? technically speaking white could have possibly been top 5 (nothing is for sure though) if he hadn't run into them earlier.. frankly i think white played at a high level and showed mad skills.. so it really breaks my heart when I see someone like HyperViperSniper post about how much trash the japanese are etc. when I know if white came down to Virginia he would clean us up like so much dirt. thx __________________ i love my coast Posted by Chris F on September 4th, 2001 02:03 AM: White could have made top 4 with a better draw I agree. I wish he used Sim in the tourney though. In the Friday morning exhibitions he didn't seem to use Sim very long, he'd swap in IM first chance he could get, but I can see the point in this, cause you may not get a second shot at getting IM in. When I use Sim I usually have Storm or Sentinel #2 so that I can play Sim as the main character. Just my opinion but I think IM is better off played first. His IM/Sentinel/Psylocke team was clearly better. __________________ Death to Monsanto. Posted by CapMaster on September 4th, 2001 03:35 AM: Here's something weird...I went to Chinatown Fair today and I saw abut 5 people with Sakura on their team. Looks like people are already sweating her..I tried her when I got home, and while I did have fun playing as her, I do feel bad in how I feel like I'm sweating her already.. __________________ If only the strong survive, that explains why I'm still alive. I will NOT be denied in my quest to become the 2002 Street Fighter World Champion! Posted by HyperViperSniper on September 4th, 2001 10:59 AM: quote: Originally posted by blt so it really breaks my heart when I see someone like HyperViperSniper post about how much trash the japanese are etc. when I know if white came down to Virginia he would clean us up like so much dirt. thx Whatever BLT you know just as well as I do that the tier rankings on here are not going to make an impact on the American players the way it does in Japan.. I never said White didnt have any skill.. My argument was to validate the reasons why Sakura isnt top tier in MarVsCap2... you always act so high and mighty like no one elses opinions count.. get over yourself HVS __________________ Check out the new revolution in gaming..the ECG site NEW FORUMS and BETTER gaming Service http://ecgamers.get-2.com Posted by Xecutioner on September 5th, 2001 12:00 AM: i have to give to white.....saying sakura is top tier in Japan! then u got scrubs stating she is the shit everywhere.im surprise cammy dosent get much talk since she did win f'n b5 for crying out loud. __________________ You are free to make choices......But you are not free to choose the consequences of your choices. -Xecutioner- Posted by Nigga_D on September 5th, 2001 01:44 AM: Where can i get the ISO for CVS2!!!!!!! i have my DC version preordered but i would like to play it now .Thanx to anyone who replies . __________________ "That was quick you sure your joystick is not busted?"-ME Posted by Smiley on September 5th, 2001 09:13 PM: i dunno... IF there was someone who could do teleport after teleport, sak WOULD be scary... heh. same as how a perfect stridoom trap is unbeatable. same premise here. and sadly, i agree with the point about the jap sticks vs american sticks. the jap sticks are looser, but but loose in a "busted up cause some 8 year old was bashing on" kinda way, but just naturally looser. makes doing motions and stuff so much easier. __________________ When in doubt, Cheese 'em out! -Last words of Smiley, before becoming a grateful scrub Posted by orochi ryu on September 6th, 2001 12:30 AM: quote: Originally posted by Mouko I agree with tragic. What the hell is up with all these "I told you so" people? like that hawaii guy who says "I agree although I don't know why" It's stupid. You see Japan and automatically think it's right. I hate mvc2, which is why I been using Morrigan/Sakura/Tron (which has been named Team Union City), I've used this team at the last SVGL tournies and beat a few people with it. I do retarded 50% throws with Sakura and Tron, 100% combo with Morrigan/Tron. "infinte" teleport with Evil sak. I don't expect to win. I'm not posting here to say "i've been using sakura before white posted!" Why? Cause even though I've been playing her for a long time, I know she still sucks. People need to stop kissing ass. None of you "knew" sakura was top or "proved it" you see Japan and jump on the bandwagon. Shush kiddies. Thank you! That's exactly what i was gonna comment on, after reading the whole thread. It really looks bad, the way you all suck up to the japanese. __________________ "Unlearn everything that you have learned, and everything will become clear" Posted by Xecutioner on September 6th, 2001 12:37 AM: instead of aurging back and forth wait till white post again..... __________________ You are free to make choices......But you are not free to choose the consequences of your choices. -Xecutioner- Posted by diegovaz on September 7th, 2001 03:14 AM: white where are you? __________________ SHOW YOUR SUPPORT FOR MVC2 ONLINE http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=28831/ Posted by State of Nature on September 7th, 2001 06:14 AM: quote: Originally posted by blt oh yea one more thing , white held it down at b5. he did real good. do you know who he lost to.. JUSTIN WONG and ALEX VALLE were his two losses in the tournament.. now how many of you wouldn't have lost there? Hm, very very true. He really did have unlucky matchups. It's like if we sent Choi to a huge tourney in Japan for Alpha 3, and his two losses are only against BAS and Daigo. That would definitely not mean he's bad. Isn't it weird how Viscant posted months ago about Evil Sak's teleport madness and it never caught any attention til now? Oh yeah, Sakura IS top tier in America already.... ...in SFA3. Posted by ShinX on September 7th, 2001 10:56 AM: Instead of arguing, I've been practicing Sak up here at Alderwood Mall north of Seattle. I can get a double-teleport down pretty consistently now. It's really nice...if they commit to a move (Proton Cannon, AHVB, etc) you can really jack them up. Sakura teleport behind, jab, jab, fierce, Hadouken xx Shinkuu Hadouken does about 50%. That's all there is to it really. Shinkuu Hadouken will go through helpers, and if they block, it chips as much as Proton Cannon. If you have no bar, launch, delay your super jump, then up, short, roundhouse senpuukyaku (hurricane kick). It's a glitched hurricane style kick that'll take off a neat chunk of life. Other things I've noticed: roundhouse hurricane kick from the ground is right at Storm's Hailstorm level. Nice way of knocking her out of that super. I actually had one guy complain about 'Sakura rushdown' (His name is Scott, I believe he came in around 32nd at B5 for MvC2). Sakura climbing up and down their character with kicks and pokes, with Sentinel assisting. The team I've been using is Spiral, Sak, Sent. (Battery, Sak, Main Assist (and damn good final character)). Spiral/Sent is hell enough on their own, throw Sakura in (alpha helper) and this can work nicely. Basically chip away with Spiral/Sent, call Sak if they get too close (shouldn't be a problem for Spiral, unless you're up against a Mag or Storm), then clean up with Sakura shinkuuhadouken combos. All for now, more will come. __________________ >"Computer games don't affect kids; I mean if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic music." ----Kristian Wilson, Nintendo, Inc, 1989 Posted by HyperViperSniper on September 7th, 2001 11:16 AM: ShinX using your Level Burner as your main assist is bad.. say for instance you are using her assist and she eats like 2 supers and your spiral dies..she comes in hurting.. basically you are saying Sak is okay..but Sent is the powerhouse.. your anchor should always be your main assist..you want your level burner to take the least amount of damage before coming in.. I thought everyone knew that.. HVS __________________ Check out the new revolution in gaming..the ECG site NEW FORUMS and BETTER gaming Service http://ecgamers.get-2.com Posted by ShinX on September 7th, 2001 09:47 PM: quote: Originally posted by HyperViperSniper ShinX using your Level Burner as your main assist is bad.. say for instance you are using her assist and she eats like 2 supers and your spiral dies..she comes in hurting.. basically you are saying Sak is okay..but Sent is the powerhouse.. your anchor should always be your main assist..you want your level burner to take the least amount of damage before coming in.. I thought everyone knew that.. HVS Ok, first and foremost, let me remind you that this team is a work in progress. Second, you state such and such a character should be used in such and such a way...this kind of thinking will limit you. I'm trying new alternatives, that's the point of my thread. Now to answer. As stated before, Sak is not my main assist, Sent is. Sakura remains relatively untouched when she jumps in. Sprial/Sentinel trap can easily build a Level 5, then snap Sakura in, transform, and I still have a bar left for shinkuuhadouken. Here I have a choice of using Sakura teleports plus dropping Sentinel for control, or instead using Sentinel on point with saving Sakura for last. I'm still working on this area. __________________ >"Computer games don't affect kids; I mean if Pac-Man affected us as kids, we'd all be running around in darkened rooms, munching magic pills and listening to repetitive electronic music." ----Kristian Wilson, Nintendo, Inc, 1989 Posted by n817azn on September 8th, 2001 01:16 AM: I just have one question "WHY DOES WHITE ALWAYS START THIS KIND OF NONSENSE AND THEN NEVER GIVE EXPLANATIONS!!!!!! !!!!!" I mean he just says one thing and then everyone, is like OH SAKURA, she is so awesome!!!! Give me a break already!!!!! I admit that i was a little intriqued by his ratings, but he never came back to give reasons which i think is a big load of crap. IMO sakura is not in the top tier, maybe the second, simply becuz of the fact that it takes a while to get to transform into evil sak. On top of that she has no double jump, a/d etc. to help catch up to beamers, unless she is evil sak. And even then you have to be perfect to teleport lets say through a ahvb. A good cable player could theoretically keep her from transforming at all if he had the right assist, unless it really is possible to dhc into the transformation. If it is then it must be some secret button patterns unlike the normal transformation move. Oh, i hope that players around here jump on the sakura band wagon so that i can have more victories. IMO this whole sh*t about sakura is getting really n8 __________________ " 3rd coast born, that means i'm Texas raised, livin lavish is a habit so i gotta stay paid.........." The late and great Fat Pat. ironman inf. from assists guide inf. to pc Posted by The Prophet on September 8th, 2001 06:37 AM: Jesus, Mary, Joseph... (oh sorry...didn't mean to drag them into this discussion...I bet they don't give a damn about Sakura either.) We can beg and plead for this White guy (wow that kinda sounds weird when you say it fast) to show up and explain himself. Personally, although I will read anything he chooses to post on this topic, what he says won't matter all that much, in the vein of top-tier MvsC2 characters. Simply put I don't think the masters are going to put the time into figuring out if there's a goldmine in Sakura...I don't see MvsC2 dying quickly, but I think games like CapvsSNK 2 are gonna take over (as far as the #1 tourney game goes.) As it stands right now, yeah, MAYBE Sakura has real potential to be a killer character...where is the evidence though? Where are the tourney results from Cali and East Coast with Sakura teams dominating the top 3? Where are the US-vs-Japan matches where the US gets teared a new one by a Sakura team? You can talk and talk all you want, but Sakura isn't making an impact. She never did. (and even though I hope this one day turns out to be false...) She never will. __________________ The Prophet "Like lambs to the slaughter" - Apocalypse Posted by DanielLarusso on September 8th, 2001 09:23 AM: How funny would it be if White came back and said: "Holy shit, did I say Sak was top tier? Fuck me! I meant Strider." __________________ "Kore zo, Bushiiin ryu." Posted by Smiley on September 9th, 2001 03:08 AM: quote: Originally posted by DanielLarusso How funny would it be if White came back and said: "Holy shit, did I say Sak was top tier? Fuck me! I meant Strider." heh.... that would be funny. __________________ When in doubt, Cheese 'em out! -Last words of Smiley, before becoming a grateful scrub Posted by Taramoor on September 10th, 2001 02:35 AM: quote: Originally posted by The Prophet Jesus, Mary, Joseph... (oh sorry...didn't mean to drag them into this discussion...I bet they don't give a damn about Sakura either.) We can beg and plead for this White guy (wow that kinda sounds weird when you say it fast) to show up and explain himself. Personally, although I will read anything he chooses to post on this topic, what he says won't matter all that much, in the vein of top-tier MvsC2 characters. Simply put I don't think the masters are going to put the time into figuring out if there's a goldmine in Sakura...I don't see MvsC2 dying quickly, but I think games like CapvsSNK 2 are gonna take over (as far as the #1 tourney game goes.) As it stands right now, yeah, MAYBE Sakura has real potential to be a killer character...where is the evidence though? Where are the tourney results from Cali and East Coast with Sakura teams dominating the top 3? Where are the US-vs-Japan matches where the US gets teared a new one by a Sakura team? You can talk and talk all you want, but Sakura isn't making an impact. She never did. (and even though I hope this one day turns out to be false...) She never will. You want to know where tourney results are? You won't find them. You want to know why? It isn't because Sakura sucks, noone knows for sure or not. It's because noone ever played her in the first place. Sakura's been around for a while, she's a semi-familiar character that never really made an impact. When she showed up in MvC2 people never even looked twice at her. Noone has really tried to find a goldmine in her at all. They looked at Cable, in depth, because he's a new character. How do they know Roll sucks? Because she was pretty good in MvC1 so people tried her right away when MvC2 came out. They found out that she sucks by trying her and realize that Capcom absolute raped her. (That sounds really horrible considering she looks like a six year-old...) The order in which characters are discovered are: 1. New characters. People spot them first and examine them the most. Cable, Ruby, Amingo... people have dissected these characters to the point of insanity. 2. Previous Powerhouses. People dominated with certain characters (Strider, Megaman, Wolverine) in MvC1, and they thought they could just do it immedeatly with the same team. They find out quickly that characters change. 3. Standards. Ryu, Ken, Guile, Cyclops. They were always there, they'll always be there. People find these people and stick with them til the end. They've been examined fairly thouroughly as well. 4. Other characters. Sakura happens to fall into this category. The last one people see, the last one people choose. They aren't really familiar, but they aren't quite new either. And Sakura has never particularly dominated in any game, so you won't find many TRULY loyal Sakura players. How can people know where Sakura falls, if they never bothered to really try? I STILL don't agree with white, I've always thought Sakura high second tier, and probably always will. But I've seen alot of new opinions and examinations of her game in this thread. If people had really bothered playing Sakura, wouldn't things like her double-teleport, her hypothetical perfect runaway, or the chip from her Shinkuu Hadouken already be known and talked about? I heard only the occasional mention, at best, of Sakura. I'm the only one at my arcade who ever EVER EVER uses her. Even the newbies who still show up say "Eh, I think I'll try Cable". After they lose to me however they pick her... and pick her... and pick her... It gets annoying facing copycats. I think I'm getting off track again, I hope I made my point. People never tried to use her in the first place, why would they try to use her in tournies? __________________ "Explorers are we, intrepid and bold, Out in the wild, amongst wonders untold. Equipped with our wits, a map, and a snack, We're searching for fun and we're on the right track!" -Calvin and Hobbes Read my Fanfic "Ultimate Gaming Megamix" (Yes, I know the title sucks) Yay! Avatar 1.0 by me... Then 2.0 by Rune... New 3.0 by SpiderOptix... Don't change your av. Upgrade! Posted by capshuma on September 10th, 2001 03:17 PM: *jumps on sakura bandwagon* Wheeeeeeeee!!! Needless to say I was both shocked and intrigued by white's latest import MvC2 rankings. So since I've always been a big fan of sakura I decided to give her another shot to see what exactly she might have going for her. After hours of research and practice I have to admit she's not half bad. Top tier maybe but I'll need to see it to believe it myself. Anyway here are some tidbits in regards to her attributes in both forms: (Virginal Sakura) -Everyone's been talking about sak as the second or third cog to a team in order for her to utilize meter and thus to be fully effective. However as a point gal she's no slouch. First of all her standing RH is king, KING I TELL YOU! It's speed, reach and priority make it one of the most effective ground normals in the game and enables her to stuff most ground rushdown tactics (I stuffed colossass'ss'ss'ss shoulder rush!!!.............no serious). Obviously this also means that she can build meter at an alarming rate with repeated standing RH's as well as jumping fierces into occasional KS' which can later trigger her dark side. -With the right assists such as Sentinel gamma or storm projectile she can abuse the immense priority of her rushing uppercut (qcf+p) which takes out the majority of attacks and assists. This same tactic can also be applied to her RH HK in order to cross up and/or gain some ground. -jumping short has decent priority in the air and when mixed in with HK can put some decent pressure on the opposition. Jumping RH has really good priority as a jump in attack and surprisingly works as an air to air counter as well due to her high priority air grab. -Her ground overhead attack is purty nifty if combined with the right assist. I was twiddling a bit with tron gamma and doom anti air playing a mildly effective high/low game. -Standing short has really great reach and priority. Dash in standing short is an exceptional pressure tactic. (Really naughty Sakura) -Obviously the one feature that stands out is her unbelievably effective teleports. P teleport into K teleport closes the gap quite well and crosses up quite nicely. Back that up with a nice assist such as the ones described above and you can have some sick rushdown at your disposal. -Shinku Hadoken is king, KING I TELL YOU. Any chain into standing RH into this does some heavy duty "pimpslappin" damage. I believe this move is also AHVB proof if blocked *motion's to cablites* "nya, nya" . On top of that I couldn't believe the chipping potential of this thing. She don't need no stinkin "Protein" Thingamajigger when she's strapped with some serious sinister chi baby! I came up with a couple tandems with her on point that might work. sak/sentinel/capcom for starters works well because the big bot enhances her rushdown while cap provides the anti rushdown and vertical coverage that she desperately needs "get back down here ya typhoon wielding slut!" Replace sentinel with BH and you can pretty much charge meter much more effectively thus making naughty sak much more of a presence. Throw in doom or tron instead of commando and you get high damage/chip potential and while their in block stun, even more opportunities to throw out a couple more standing RH's. So in essence she's pretty decent in skillful hands but of course room for error is very tight. Don't sleep on this school girl because she just might take that Hyper Viper Gun and stick it straight back up that anal track from which it came. Master John Posted by n817azn on September 10th, 2001 05:46 PM: I praticed some more with sak. and i still have the opinion that she is not all that great. Now what i wanta know is if it is really possible to just teleport through a beam. Well, imo it is and it isn't. I know a couple of you on here have said that you've teleported through a hvb PC, etc. Well i did also, but at the very beginning of the beam. I also noted that one of you said it has 0 start up time. So, i tried about 1 million times to teleport into the ahvb which worked out fine but then when i tried to do it again, no way jose. WHen you teleport into the middle of the beam, and then try to teleport out again you get blasted. But how is this possible if it really has a 0 startup time. So i don't think that if you're all the way across the screen from someone like cable that you could teleport twice through the ahvb to get to him. I tried and tried and tried but it would never work. And yes i can do the teleport over and over flawlessly without the beam there, but when the beam is there and i teleport into it, it does not let me teleport again. SO, why don't u guys try it, and i'm talking about teleporting into the middle of the beam and then teleporting again out of the beam. Just so there can be no mistakes about what i'm saying, cuz i don't think that you can do it. If you can, then someone needs to make a vid of this to show it. n8 __________________ " 3rd coast born, that means i'm Texas raised, livin lavish is a habit so i gotta stay paid.........." The late and great Fat Pat. ironman inf. from assists guide inf. to pc Posted by PikaPuff on September 10th, 2001 08:10 PM: i've done it...... ONCE... so that doesn't give much credit huh? long ass time ago, i teleported into the green abyss' white super beam and then again right out of it. so yeah, i think it's possible. i don't know if the properties of green abyss's beam are different than AHVB or PC, but i know what i did. of course, i've been trying to do it for the past year ever since and haven't been able to do it again. so i'm positive you can do it, against abyss's beam at least. but i also consider it highly improbable to do. __________________ --- Roll(a/g)/Servebot(g)/T.Bonne(g): "3% Wins and going strong!" Jill/Sakura/T.Bonne: "Mags Rushdown? Zombie that shit... 'X' Trap? Hiyakeshita Sakura Tp that shit." All times are GMT. The time now is 10:32 PM. Powered by: vBulletin Version 2.0.0 Release Candidate 3 Copyright © Jelsoft Enterprises Limited 2000, 2001.